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Want ads that convert? We’ve got 2 things to say about that:

1 – you’re not alone. We hear you! Our clients ask us this all the time and…

2 – THIS is the episode you need to listen to. Shelby Fowler breaks down how to get your ads converting step by step – to the point where you’ll feel ready to start running your ads right away!

This is an episode you don’t want to miss if you’ve ever thought about running ads for your business.


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Project Broadcast

Our transcript hasn't been proofed, so there will probably be some errors. Sorry about that!

Alyson Lex 0:03
One of the biggest questions I get from any of my clients is, how do I run ads, Facebook ads, Instagrams, whatever ads, right? YouTube, I don't care. They all want to know how to get traffic, how to get eyeballs, how to get people to see their stuff to opt in and buy. This is probably a big question for you too. Because traffic matters. And that's why we've got Shelby Fowler here today, because she's going to talk to us about some of the best practices for ads, how to get them working, how to get them converting how not to waste and throw away all your money. Shelby, thank you so much for being here with us. Thank you for having me. All right, let's just get it out of the way. Okay, my dad's working, what am I doing wrong?

Shelby Fowler 0:57
That's a great question. there's a there's a few things that are very common mistakes that people make, the top one I see is that you're not spending enough money. So if you're not spending enough money, you're not getting in front of enough people for your ads to optimize, which is fancy Facebook talk for Facebook doesn't have enough data. So it keeps you know, it's like spinning its wheels, right? So we want to be spending enough money to get in front of enough people so that Facebook has enough data to then move and push our ads to more people. Does that make sense? Awesome. So totally, yes, that's one of the top mistakes people make not spending enough money. The next is that audiences, right? If the right people aren't seeing your ads, they're not going to click on it. Or you're going to get at, you're going to get leads that are not qualified for your business, right. So if you've ever run ads, this is a lot of people. And you're like, Okay, I'm getting people to opt into my stuff, but they're not qualified, right? They just don't seem like they have money, or they're not really my ideal client or customer. Well, that's an audience issue, you need to really do some research on who is going to be your best audience. And a lot of that is testing. So if you're not testing enough, that can result in in not getting in front of the right people. The next the third one, I would say, Why are your ads not performing really well. Your creative sucks, right? So your graphics and your copy are just not good. So I see this a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot with people. And you may think, Oh my gosh, this is a great graphic. But the data is going to tell you differently, probably. So something to look for, is when you're inside of ads manager, look at your CTR, which stands for click through rate. And you want to look at the link, click through rate. Okay? If you look at that, and it's over 1%, if that little piece of data is over 1% that means that your ad creative is good, like you're doing good. If it's under 1%, we need to make some adjustments. And usually that little number correlates with your ad cost. So if your ad cost is astronomical, it probably means that you need to have like you need to rejuvenate your your advertising graphics or video and the written portion of your ad.

Alyson Lex 3:42
Alright, so I know that you do this with your people, I want to kind of go point by point because you gave us so much information here. So how much do you teach your students are spending on behalf of your clients? How much should we be spending to fix that? That first problem? Right?

Shelby Fowler 4:02
So most of my clients are running ads to a conversion event. So a webinar, a live launch a free challenge, something like that. What I tell them is we want to reverse engineer your ad budget. So right now cost per registration is somewhere between usually eight and $15 per registration, for webinars for live launches any sort of conversion event. And this is going into also, you know, holiday season, right? So holiday New Year's, it's going to be a little bit more expensive. You're competing against the big box retailers, you're you're competing against a lot of other advertisers that are spending millions of dollars. So it's very normal for ad cost to be slightly higher. So right now that's what it's looking like. So what I would do if you're look thinking about how much money should I spend Take like $12 and multiply it by however many people you want registered for your event, and then you'll have a rough estimate of what you should spend. So if you take 12 times 300, whatever that equals would be a rough estimate of your ad budget. Now, the other ad that people are running all the time is lead magnets, right? We want leads, we want to grow our email list. So a lead magnet, my rule of thumb is under $5, like, I want my lead magnets, I want to pay less than $5 to get people on my email list. So again, if you take five times I want 300 people on my email list this month, there you There you go, you have a rough estimate of what your ad budget should be. Does that make sense?

Jennie Wright 5:50
So incredibly, yes, yes. All the ways it makes sense.

Shelby Fowler 5:54
I'm big into reverse engineering, everything, like let's start off having an idea of what we should spend, and then we can work backwards, instead of just kind of throwing a number out there.

Jennie Wright 6:05
Me too. I'm huge. Start from the end goal and work your way back. It's fascinating that if we want to get 300 people on our webinar, that we're looking at an ads budget of approximately 30 $600. That makes sense to me. And then if I you know, and then you were saying by by what you were talking about, you were saying, if we want 300 people into our lead magnet, you know, times that like you're like, What is a $5? You were saying I'd be a good ad cost for that. So it's 15 $100. But think about it this way. If your program product or service is a $4,000 or $6,000 coaching package, then you've basically paid for your ads. Right. So it's worth doing that. I have a quick question. How do you know all this? What is it that you do? Explain like, what Shelby Fowler does?

Shelby Fowler 6:55
Yeah. So a lot of it is a lot of experience, right? So just working inside of clients, ad accounts, and, and paying attention to the numbers and analytics. So I know what the norms are. But I'm a student of advertising. And specifically on Facebook and Instagram, I'm constantly learning. And it's always changing, right? And that's kind of the frustrating part. For a lot of people, a lot of business owners who want to advertise is it's always changing. So as soon as you think you got it, boom, a new update, right? It's always evolving, which is something I think I like, I like that there's never a dull moment. It's always evolving. So yeah, a lot of it is just the experience and being inside in the trenches with clients and figuring out like, what's working, what's not, what are the normal ad costs right now?

Jennie Wright 7:52
So my next question that I think is like sort of a good follow up from this is, is it better to ad? Is it better to run ads to a freebie like a lead magnet where you'd be spending like 15 $100 to get your 300 leads? Or is it better to a webinar? We'd be paying like 30 $600 to get your 300 leads? Or is it better to a paid offer? Or is an awareness campaign better? What's the best way that we can spend our money when we're doing paid advertising?

Shelby Fowler 8:18
Great question. So it's gonna depend on your offer, let me explain. If you have a low ticket offer, if it's something only a couple $100, maybe $1,000 or less, consider doing a an ad to a lead magnet, and on the thank you page, it being a tripwire. So like But wait, you know, here, click here and get this offer for $200 or whatever. And then on the back end, make sure that your marketing and your emails and everything that you are pitching your paid offer, that's going to be probably the most effective webinars in any sort of conversion event are the best when you're selling high ticket, right? My rule of thumb, if you're going to run ads to a paid product directly to a sales page, you need to be spending approximately in real like at least the price of that product per day. So if you have a $27 product, you would need to be spending like roughly 2730 bucks a day. And that's pretty low, even still. So because of that, like when you're selling high ticket you need and you're running ads to a cold audience, people that don't know who you are, we need them to like know and trust you before they're willing to give you their credit card number and spend 1000s of dollars with you, right? So that's why a conversion event is always the best method when you're selling something for you know, 3456 whatever. $1,000 we have clients to do sell $30,000 programs via, you know, a live launch method. And that's that is by far the most effective And like you'd stated earlier, when you're spending, let's say, 30 $500 in ads, but you're selling a cut, like set, let's say you sold six programs. Well, at three that let's say your program is what did I say? $3,000? You know, it's worth it, it covers everything, right? So I think a lot of people make the mistake of running ads to low ticket offers, thinking that they're gonna make a huge return. And that's just not usually the case. So unless you're, you know, you're investing a lot of money in advertising. And it's usually not the case. So I'm a big fan of conversion events. Again, if you're selling low ticket, do a back end offer, run ads to a lead magnet, have your offer on the thank you page, and then via email, make sure you're marketing your offer that way.

Alyson Lex 10:59
I love that you're talking about the back end, because this is where I get to play. Right? When it comes to ads, I got nothing. I have, I have something but it's not much. I know enough to know, I don't know enough. When it comes to the back end stuff, is there any kind of best practice or suggestion on the type of funnel other than simply that offer on the thank you page? What should we be doing to maximize our results.

Shelby Fowler 11:27
So it's gonna depend on the type of like, offer and funnel that you have. For a lead magnet, if you're running ads to a lead magnet, I definitely suggest having a an offer on that thank you page. Video does really well, as well, as well, because again, when you're running ads to a cold audience, and this is what a lot of people don't understand. In fact, I've had clients who make millions and millions of dollars a year in the coaching industry, and we've had to have the like hard talk of, okay, remember that your warm audience is always going to convert much higher, right, they just are not used to a 2% conversion rate with with cold audience, right, we have to go through kind of the basics of marketing again, because they're so far along that they forget it. So what you have to understand is that when you are running ads to people that you don't know, you want new people in your world, right? They don't know you, they don't like you yet. Video is the best way to build that rapport quickly. Because it's as close as we can get to face to face. Right. So having a video on a on a thank you page is great. Also, PS video ads are great. But that's that would, I would say that's the best method when you're doing a lead magnet, like have that offer on the thank you page if you're doing a webinar. And they're gonna go to a registration page, right? They're gonna put in their name, email, I asked for phone number. Now there's legalities around that, make sure that you have your terms and conditions in order like, you know, straight, but ask for their phone number and then ask I've been asking for their Instagram handle. And the reason why I've been doing that, is that you can you or your sales team can go back and message people find them in Instagram, and kind of start to build that relationship, right? Because I'm all about high touch marketing. Like let's, you know, I don't want everything to feel so robotic. I think we're all very used to that. Everybody. Everything is evergreen everything is you know, automated and I love automation. However, we lose that personal touch. So if you want to win the game, especially in high ticket, high touch is the way to go. Like you're going to win against everybody else if you're high touch. So I asked, that's why I asked for the Instagram handle. Um, the best funnels I've seen that when you they ask for the phone number, you also get a confirmation text right away. That's like, Hey, thanks for registering for the webinar. Here's the link in case you missed it right. And of course, they're getting an email confirmation right away, as well. But again, email open rates aren't that great usually. So you know, it's not 100%. So text messages have a much higher open rate. So do both. Okay. And then on the thank you page you can have again, you can have a video, you can have like saying, Hey, here's the next steps. Make sure that you click below to access the webinar if it's evergreen, or make sure that you check your email for the link to access the webinar. Again, like having getting in touch with them in multiple ways is the best way to go. If you can email them if you can text them and if you have clear expectations for your person going through your funnel. Like if they know exactly what to expect in each step, they're much more likely to convert. Instead of, you know, I don't know, if you guys have ever signed up for a webinar, I'm sure where you're like, what was that? What am I supposed to do now? You know, and it's just like, thank you, you get to the thank you page. It's like, thanks. You're all set. And you're like, all set for what do you what do I

Alyson Lex 15:23
do unique in my language? Yes.

Shelby Fowler 15:27
Yeah, and that's like that. I mean, that might be one of the most frustrating things, right. So again, high touch is the way to go. If you can tell them exactly what to expect. Step one, check your email, you're gonna get a link to join the webinars. Step two, join the Facebook group, you know, come come join the party on Facebook, I share weekly tips, you know, get them into your community. Again, what you have to understand with cold leads is we can fill your webinars with advertising, but you need to be pulling them into your communities, you need to be pulling them into your audience, then you don't want them to just sit there on your email list and just kind of grow stale. You need to be pulling them in to other avenues, other marketing channels so that you can they see you, right? Um, my goal is always like, if someone enters my funnel, I want them to never forget me. Like I want to inundate them with my face. Right? Like, I'm not a big Grant Cardone fan, but I heard Grant cardones saying this once he was like, we basically as soon as someone opts in to something, we just like slam them, they're getting all of our ads. Like we have retargeting ads, they're getting emails, they're getting text messages, they're getting, you know, Facebook message, like all the things, right. And I think that's a little aggressive, like, his approach is always a little aggressive, or a lot aggressive. But the concept is, right, the same like I want people to when they opt in to my funnel, when they opt in to a client's funnel, when they opt in to your funnel, I want them to be like, Wow, she's amazing, I'm keep seeing her stuff, I need to work with her. They, there's so much out there, trying to get your ideal clients attention, right, they're consuming so much content every day, they're scrolling through things, there's so many emails, your stuffs gonna get missed. And it's not because they don't want to work with you. It's just that we it's now you know, they say now it takes like 16 touch points to to convert a lead into a to get them into either a call to get them into a sale, like it used to be 10 or 12, right, or 10 or 12. And now it's 16. Because there's so much out there. So there's so much noise. So I want you to stand out. And I think the best way to do that is having a funnel that sets that clear expectation, but also pulling them into your other marketing channels, so you can nurture them.

Jennie Wright 18:01
That was a mini webinar right there. That one answer was awesome. You piqued my interest, though with something that you said. And it made Allison and I both write a note to each other going. We're doing this one was asking for people's phone numbers, and two was asking for the Instagram handles. But my follow up is how are you with the with the text messaging? What system? Are you do you recommend that your clients use to do that? Because we get asked that question a lot. We know one or two but you probably know better ones than us. And then number two, with the Instagram handle. Is it a personalized thing? Or is it a bot?

Shelby Fowler 18:38
So okay, phone number. I have clients that use all types of things. Um, I like slick text is really easy to use. In fact, I researched it years ago, because it was what Dean grazioso he and Tony Robbins were using in there, you know, every year they have that huge masterclass launch. They have a team. Yeah, yeah. And that's what they were using several years ago. I did a lot of research. This was a couple years ago, but I'm not sure if that's what they're still using. But it's very user friendly. So I have clients using that project broadcast is another one. And that one has a little bit more of I think you can text back

Jennie Wright 19:21
Yeah, we have a client that uses that one right now. And pretty cool on the inside. Not bad. Not bad.

Shelby Fowler 19:29
More techie Yep. I'm more techie. I also another one that I liked that but it is you cannot like if someone registers for something and they drop their their phone number, you can't text them from community but a lot of a lot of influencers. A lot of business people are using community. Now community is a platform though, that that person actually has to text you first in order for them. to opt in, you are not able to, to like, grab, you know, or input phone numbers. So, community is awesome. However, again, like you, they have to physically text you first. So if you were to do community, what you could do is on that thank you page, say, hey, make sure to text this number, and we're gonna get you the link to Xyz. So that's a way to go about that if you wanted to use community I know like Gary Vee uses community. And again, that's like really personal as well. But it's very user friendly, much more user friendly, I find in Project broadcast, and then for the Instagram, right, how do we, is this a bot that's going to message them? No. So I have a salesperson. And I think at some point, everybody should hire a salesperson, or at least a VA, who's really a sales and marketing person. But I have somebody in her job simply is to follow up with leads, and close them, right, she gets them on calls. And she's she, it's her job to make sure everybody gets access to training that we're doing that they signed up for, to follow up with them to get them on a call to eventually, you know, close them. So it is her texting them. Like that's what it is. And she's just gonna go through and say like, hey, Mary, I saw that you do XYZ from your profile, I love that, you know, I'm from I work with fempire media. And we noticed that you just registered for a webinar, I'd love to hop on a Connect call with you, and see how we might be able to help you and, you know, network with you share how we might be able to help you or any content that you might like, whatever. So her job is to get on like those 1520 minute calls, and really get to know the business owner. And then if it makes sense, invite them to a sales conversation if they're ready, right. But and pretty much that initial conversation that she's having with that lead is a qualifying conversation, right? We're asking questions like, tell me about your offers, right? We want to know what their offers look like. We want to know how much they're charging. We want to know how many people are in their offers. And then we start to kind of do the math, okay, they're making about this much money. This makes sense for us to offer our programs or our our, you know, paid offers to to this person. Does that make sense?

Alyson Lex 22:37
makes so much sense. And thank you so much for breaking this down. I know it might feel like we went down a little bit of a rabbit hole because now we're not talking about ads we're talking about after ads. But that's where it works. That's where the conversion happens. So it is really related. And I love how you're talking about what you said. And I'll talk about this later in the takeaways, but like we can get you registrations, you have to then do something with it. I think that's really very poignant, actually. Because it's true.

Shelby Fowler 23:09
I feel a lot of people, a lot of people say I ran ads, I got X amount of leads, I got X amount of registrations, and then nothing happened. And so they think the ads didn't work. And, you know, the truth is the ads did their job. They did work, you didn't work ads don't fix a broken sales problem. And again, going back to that I have had clients who run multiple multiple million dollar seven figure businesses per year, and they forget that the the time it takes to nurture a cold lead is much longer than a warm lead. So again, like you have to after ads, that's a podcast in itself, right? Like if like it's like after dark after ads. Um, yeah, let's do that. I would totally there, you should totally do that. But it's so true, right? Like, that's where you're that's where the magic happens is like your marketing strategy. Once people join once people are in your funnel, once they're on your list, once they're, you know, in your webinar, in your launch in your Facebook group, what happens like you have to be nurturing them.

Alyson Lex 24:23
Alright, so I want to kind of skip back to the ad creation. Yes, we could talk about after ads and I think maybe we've just come up with a whole new episode idea. But what when I'm creating a new ad for my thing, right, I've got maybe I've got my targeting set up. How do I get started on this creative because you said earlier that if my creative sucks my ads not going to work. So how do I make sure my creative doesn't suck?

Shelby Fowler 24:52
Okay, I have some really juicy insight for you. So here are the secrets to Really good ad creative. So your graphics, brighter colors work best, right? Ultimately, we want to create a pattern interrupt when someone is in scroll mode. Okay, you're scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, you're consuming a lot of content, you're flipping through it, you want something that goes, wait, what? Well, what is that? Right? It slows their scroll, it scroll stopping, if you will, right. And again, it's like, the psychology of this is that it has to be a pattern interrupt, it has to be different than everything else that they're seeing, so that they slow down and doubletake. Right, they look at it at twice, and then ultimately will read your ad copy. So the best the my best tips here are to include more fluid or circular shapes in your graphics. The reason why is because everything on Facebook, everything on Instagram, with the exception of stories and your profile photo are square or rectangle, right. And typically, we're on a on a device consuming this content that is a rectangle shape, right your laptop, rectangle, computer screen, rectangle, phone, iphone, samsung, whatever you have, it's a rectangle, you have to create a pattern interrupt. So if you if you show them a circle, or a fluid, like movement or shape, it's different than anything else that's on the platform, right? They're gonna go Whoa, what's what's that? So that's, that's a big tip there. Um, if you're going to use photography of yourself, like a headshot and the graphic, please make sure it looks professional. Alright, um, my best performing my personal best performing photos of myself have been ones where I'm making like a funny face. And clearly I have pink hair for those that don't know. So it's like people are gonna naturally doubletake. Right and that's not by accident, right? I the joke around the house is like, I can't even go back blonde if I wanted to. Because, you know, this just not who I am. It just I feel like my hair is made me so much money. It's your banana. recognize you. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So I, I suggest like, it may be when you're doing brand photos as well. Next time you do a photo shoot, try do a few photos with like a brighter colored shirt, like a yellow or a red. Or I've had clients who have like, even females who have like a power suit on with like a bright red like shirt underneath. And it just, it's striking, right? Think about that. Try not to have like doll or, or natural or nude colors on, try to have some photos that have a little bit of a pop. Because you can use that in your advertising. And I promise you, it'll pay off. So brighter colors, right? Make sure that you're you're using circles and different shapes. The other thing I want to talk about color is the color blue. Okay, what is Facebook's brand color?

Jennie Wright 28:21
Blue, blue, blue. Yeah.

Shelby Fowler 28:23
So if you can avoid using a lot of blue and your graphics. Please do it. Because the reason why we're talking about pattern interrupts again, if if you're consuming all this content and you see a bunch of blue, naturally, you're going to assume it's just going to blend into Facebook's feed, because you're going to kind of assume it's like a Facebook thing, right? Again, you want to create something that's different. oranges, yellows, pinks, reds, they perform really well, even greens, like use brighter greens. They perform really well. Well. And then last tip on graphics here because this is like, this is where people fall short, so many times the verbiage on your graphic, it matters, right the words that are on your graphic. matters so much. So my biggest tip here is to lead with what is in it for them lead with what is in it for them and not free challenge on lead generation rate. lead gen cool, they're gonna scroll past that. What are they getting out of that? What are they gonna walk away with? Right? Get 100 leads in five days, okay, that's a lot more interesting to them, right? What is in it for them. And when you're, when you're putting text on your graphic, make sure that you're leaving with that that's the text and it's not like a free Facebook ads channel. Instead, when I create graphics for my Facebook ad workshops, I put create highly profitable, irresistible Facebook ads in five days, right or something like that where they're like, okay, highly profitable. Yes, that's what everybody wants. They want to make money, right? They want to learn how to create irresistible Facebook ads. Heck yeah. And I always put like, and making it fun and easy. Because, again, if you're in the tech world, or if you're doing something that's more high level strategy, what tends to happen is we don't want we don't want Charlie Brown voice people are like, they tune out because it's, it's too much for them. So if you can find a way to make something fun and easy, or hear or creak, like contradiction, so if you're teaching something like accounting or bookkeeping, that's boring. People don't like that. So use fun colors and your graphics make it fun. Maybe your graphic is like you doing like a funny like face or something because people are like, Whoa, that's totally contradicting. And and it's going to grab attention.

Alyson Lex 31:10
Holy guacamole, I'm so glad we take notes during these episodes, because now I know exactly what to do and what not to do, right? That was awesome. Okay.

Jennie Wright 31:21
By the way, just as a thing, I mean, knowing what to do, but I still don't want to do it.

Alyson Lex 31:25
So I'm still hiring. No, that's a given. That's a given. But now I have a better idea. And when somebody says, How do I run ads? I say, Good. Listen to this episode, Michelle day, because she's amazing. Alright, I, let's, let's say I've made my ads, I've got my my 1% click through rate, all of that. How do I get to that magical world? Do I just kind of test stuff until I land on it? Is it like magic? Or is there a strategy to get my ads to be better? Each time I revise or run them?

Shelby Fowler 32:01
Yeah, apps, there's definitely a lot of strategy that goes behind testing and optimizing advertising. Um, I had a call with someone the other day, and she said, Okay, so you're going to create my ads. And, you know, we we are not, we're not a cheap marketing or advertising agency to hire, when she's like, hey, you're going to create our ads, but then like, then what, like, then what are you going to do? And I was like, oh, man, this is where the work comes in. Right? Like, I was like, well, we're gonna, you know, we're testing all of this stuff, we're checking it, you know, one to two times a day to make sure that everything looks good, and making adjustments on the fly all the time. So there's no short answer for this. Because there's so we could, we could have like a full on 10 day conference about this. And with like, step by step tutorials, it's, but my suggestion is here, if you are wanting to run ad ads, and you're not very experienced, I'm going to give you a couple of quick tips here. But my suggestion is to go hire someone to do it for you, it's a lot easier to hire someone for a couple months to get your ads going. And then you can maintain them. If you you know, and maybe have hire them for a strategy session after so they can teach you, you know how to maintain your ads. And then to start off, and what happens a lot of times is people start their ads and like, this looks great. They start it and then it's like, I don't know what I'm looking at, like, what are these numbers mean? Right? And then you're like, Okay, so Shelby told me that this click link, click through rate is supposed to be 1%. But then like, what is this other stuff mean? Or what do I do? If it's not? Or you know, so, there's so many different things. However, so hire someone if you can. But if you are doing your own ads, here's my tip for you. I want you to test Three, two to three different audiences. Okay. So you want to create audiences that are about two to 5 million people in that audience size. Okay. And once you get to that, then you can you know, somewhere in between there, your that's your campaign, okay? And then start a new campaign with the same graphics with the same copy. It's just going to a different audience. That would be the first test I do. I want to see what audience is performing best with my ads with my offer, right? My offer and my ads. And the thing is, is like you'll be able to see there's there's things that you can look at to see our people clicking on my ad, but they're not liking my offer. Maybe your landing page sucks. That's another thing, right? ads can work and then they get to your landing page and they'll Like, oh, womp womp womp like, Nope, I don't want to opt in here. So my suggestion is to test audiences first and then give that about a week and see what is performing best. And by performing best, I mean, what cost less, and what is yielding the most results. So if you have 15 registrations to your webinar from one, and then you have five from another and 36 from another, clearly we have a winner, you're 36 people keep that ad going, and probably turn off the you know, ad that was only yielded five people, right? turn that one off. So that's my like, that would be basic level first. first test, anything after that, it starts to get a little bit more complex. And so I would say, just figure out what audiences are going to perform best. And if you're not at 1%, click through rate. Remember, that means you need to, I would change up your graphic or video first.

Jennie Wright 36:04
Okay, another masterclass in the past five minutes, for we're loving this, this is very selfish of us, because we are taking so many notes and we're just like, haha, this is so good. And just by the way, Alyson also did a quick tip on conversion checkpoints, that will give some more insight as well into this whole conversation about what's converting and not and with Allison's copywriting skills. Definitely go and check that one out. I highly recommend that quick tip.

Alyson Lex 36:33
I cannot thank you enough. This is this has been awesome. Okay. So we're going to test different audiences with the same ad. If it doesn't work, we're going to fix the creative. We should I'm just recapping those first three things that you said, right creative budget audience. So we're testing the audience. We're getting the creative, you've told us how to do that the budget is based on what results we want. Now we're ready to run an ad. I can't. Yeah. Or we're just going to call you and hire us. So how can people do that? How come they connect with you?

Shelby Fowler 37:08
Yeah, absolutely. So if you want completely done for you, we have that available, you can you can go to Empire And you can book a call with me or my team and and we can walk through what running ads would look like for your business. And I like to kind of go through the numbers with you on the call. So you have an idea of what that would look like, what the investment is going to look like, and what results could look like. So you can book a call there, if you're wanting to learn how to do it, your yourself, we do have a program for that as well. Right. And that's step by step, you have the support of ad experts that you have access to weekly that you can get on calls with. And you can go to Empire to get access to that and find out more about that as well.

Jennie Wright 38:00
Fantastic. I'm already on your website, looking at the course right there. So that's amazing. Looks like incredible value to. So I just want to take a second to say thank you so much for doing this. And before we run, we've got a couple takeaways that have been sort of the big aha moments from today's episode, I think there was about nine, we had to break it down into a vote for so I'm going to go first. Mine is if you want to win the game of high ticket ads, go high touch instead of simply automating everything. I think that's something that people forget, they're like, they get a little bit of an ego, thinking that they don't have to still communicate with people on a personal level. People are still people still want to interact with people. And people can still determine most of the time if they're talking to a bot. So using that high touch, you know, really getting in touch with people and giving a crap is what I like to say some give a crap about people and they'll give a crap back. That's my favorite. That is the first takeaway. I

Alyson Lex 38:53
love that one. When you said this, I was like, Yes, ads don't fix a broken sales system. And you even went on you were like magic happens once they get into your world. And that, yeah, like the ads do their job. If they make the registrations happen. That's their job. Beyond that, it's up to you. So I know it's, I've had clients too, that are like, Oh, we just need to run ads. Well, maybe we should think about that. So I really like the way you said that.

Jennie Wright 39:35
Me too. I love actually I'm going crazy over here with these takeaways. My next one is reverse engineering, everything that is one of my big, big things that I love to do. I always start at the end and work my way back. So starting off having an idea of what you should spend and working your way backwards to figure out your budget. I'm all about the numbers. So again, you gave that great example if you want 300 leads and the approximate cost is about 15,000 For those conversion events, right, then you're making your budget as you go, you know what you need to spend to get there. And then you can get all, you know, funky with audiences and playing around, which I think is great. I think

Alyson Lex 40:11
it's really good to that that helps set expectations. Because I think sometimes we have this expectation, well, we can get 100 people in our event for you know, $5 a day. Well, again, let's, let's do the math. Let's look at that. Let's look at the numbers, and see what that expectation really should be. And speaking of numbers, you might love your ad, the data might tell a different stories. So stick with the numbers and not your gut. Because the numbers don't lie in your gut can lead you astray. Especially if you don't know the data, especially if you don't know enough, that's always lean on the data to tell you what's working. And if you don't know what those data points mean, then you need to hire someone or maybe you can talk shall be in to book a consult with you to help you understand it.

Jennie Wright 41:06
Absolutely. Thank you so much, Shelley for doing this with us. We really appreciate it. This is amazing episode. It was one of the longer ones, but it definitely had a ton of information, every single answer you gave was pretty much its own little mini training right there. So thanks so much for doing this with us. Thank you for having me. Yeah, absolutely, of course. And we will definitely have you back. There's probably about I don't know, I think we thought about three or four different episodes, just based on today. So don't worry, we'll have Shelby back again on the System to THRIVE podcast. In the meantime, make sure you're checking out this episode at System to THRIVE comm checking out the show notes, so you can connect with Shelby and get all the juicy information about everything that we talked about today. In addition, make sure you're following us or subscribing wherever it is that you listen to podcasts so you don't miss another episode like this. And thank you so much for listening. We really do appreciate that you're here and that you're taking this information and we hope that it helps. So thanks so much and take care. We'll answer another big question soon.



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