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Have you ever wanted to write a book? Either on you own or with some other entrepreneurs for what they call a “collab chapter book?” 

Well we have. And to get all the deets on what it takes to become an author and why it’s such a good authority tool in your business we had to have Vince Warnock here with us. 

In this episode we’re covering the what, the how and the why of writing or contributing to a book and what being a published author can do for your business.


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The bookseller that supports local bookstores mentioned by Vince in the episode.

Contagious by Jonah Berger – the book Vince mentioned participating in the launch of.

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Our transcript hasn't been proofed, so there will probably be some errors. Sorry about that!

Alyson Lex 0:03
If you've thought about writing a book, and maybe set it aside, or maybe you haven't thought about writing a book, but you're interested in whether it's possible for you, this guest says that everyone has a book in them. I told him, I wasn't going to steal it from him. He said he stole from someone else. And now we're repeating it here to you. Launching Your book is an essential part of this being an author process. And so he's a podcast host. He's an author. He's a visibility coach, and he is a friend of System to THRIVE. It's Vince Warnock, who's going to talk to us about book launches. And all that goes into events. Thanks for being here.

Vince Warnock 0:42
Oh, my goodness. Thanks for having me, guys. I mean, secretly, this is just a chance for us to catch up. So it's all good.

Alyson Lex 0:49
So you are an author? You're a published author. Now, did you self published? Or did you go through the traditional publishing route?

Vince Warnock 0:57
I actually started by going down the traditional publishing route. I, when I first kind of put out into the universe, I'm going to write a book. At the time, I was the Chief Marketing Officer at Cigna, I had a couple of I was about to name them, I probably shouldn't name them publicly, a couple of big publishers approached me and say, hey, we'd love to publish your book. And so sitting down with them, the one thing that I did appreciate about their approach was they were very honest with me. And they said to me, Look, you know, the reality is, if we're publishing your book, you don't fully control this, we will give you the style that will be written and we will, basically they work with you, you have to write the book, but they work with you. And they will rewrite it for you. And unlike Well, it was really important to me if I wrote a book that it felt like someone was sitting in the room with me, which means it's going to hit my stupid dad jokes. And then it's going to have my kind of terrible English at times. And all this, it's got to feel like it's a connection to me. And they didn't sit with them. It didn't sit with me. So I decided at that point, I was going to Self Publish. And that was an interesting journey. Like even just trying to find the right developmental editor, the right proofreader, all those kinds of things to help me out was difficult. But when I did find that, I realized that there are some downsides to self publishing, that can be overcome relatively easy. So I set up my own publishing company, which kind of did by accident, I really just wanted to make sure that the developmental editor and the proofreader were available for my next book, and they both kind of commented and said, Wow, you know, we're really busy. And I'm like, Whoa, hang on, have that aha, you full time. And they went, Okay, well, what do we do? I don't know, we'll figure it out. And then birthdays, publishing companies. All of a sudden, I have new company to publish my books to publish my clients books and things like that as well. And we got some really talented additional people on board to help us out. So So kind of going down all three routes, really.

Jennie Wright 2:39
So when we asked you earlier, what you we what we what you wanted us to call you. And you just said, Sir, we said Now, what you should have said is, you know, startup cheating? Yes. Five, you know, a little bit a little bit of fly by night a little bit a little

Alyson Lex 2:57
while you're a pantser person. Yeah, right.

Vince Warnock 3:01
I'm giving you two to write my bio from now on this six.

Jennie Wright 3:05
Do you ever want a first person by the way? Anybody first person or third? The only person should write is Alyson Lex. Okay, that's it. Hands down. She is the best at bios. Okay, so going on your own and wanting to do your own book launch? I'm working. we're hypothesizing here. What are the steps to actually you've written the book, it's time to launch it? What are the actual steps to creating a successful book launch that, you know, is not going to feel gross and spammy? And drive? Everybody who knows you nuts? This is an Amway or something, we don't have to like friends and family this crap. So how do we do this properly?

Vince Warnock 3:38
Well, the first step happens long before that point, because obviously, if you got to the point where you got the book ready to publish, so I'm not gonna say it's too late, because it's never too late. But you shouldn't be like, even during, and this is what I discovered, during the process of writing the book, I started to talk about that externally. And I did this deliberately, because I wanted to hold myself to account I knew, you know, having ADHD and everything distracting me, I was going to find it difficult to finish this thing. So I thought, if I put it out there, if I tell people about it, then they're going to hold me to account because it's gonna be super embarrassing if I don't publish. But in doing so I discovered the other secret, which is, the more you involve people during the writing process, the more that they feel involved in this. And a good example of this, I'm gonna use somebody else's book is Jonah Berger. So Jonah Berger is one of my favorite authors. He is, I can't remember what university I think it's Stanford or something like that. He's based out of it. He's a lecturer. He studied under Chip and Dan Heath, and he wrote contagious, which is one of my favorite books in marketing. I reread that book every single year. And he had a new book coming out. So he set up a Facebook group and he said to everyone, Hey, guys, I'd love your feedback. I've got four different cover designs, can you let me know which one appeals to you? What do you feel when you see each of these? So every single one of us gave our feedback, but the funny thing is, I didn't know what his book was about, but I knew I was going to buy it. And the reason I knew I was gonna buy it is because I felt like it was part of I felt like I was part of it. Writing Process, I felt connected to this book. So bringing people on the journey with you. And you can do that a number of ways. They don't have to Prouds source the book for you. But you can give them cover options you can give them a good one I tried was the name of chapters. So if you've got a chapter, and it's about something, you say to them, Hey, when you hear this title, this chapter title, what do you think this chapter is going to be about, and you get them to give you feedback. And the more you do that, you build up your kind of launch tribe, you build up this bunch of people who are invested in the book. So that way, when you get close to the time where you want to publish, you've already got a crowd there that are going, Hey, we want to help you to succeed in this area. The other thing you need to do, too, is like you need to ask people about that. So in other words, don't just put it out there and hope people respond to this. He went out and said to people, Look, I'm launching a book. It's really exciting for me, I would love your help on this. Are you interested in helping it's going to involve you doing some social posts, it's going to involve you purchasing the book, it will involve? I'll give you a massive discount. And they'll involve you giving me a rating or a review as well. And I had some people say no, mainly because there was conflict of interest, because they're the only publishing companies and things. But the majority of people said yes. And so I just started to build that tribe prior to the launch itself.

Alyson Lex 6:16
Okay, so on book, drop day, book launch, you might have some pre orders, you've got some advanced copy readers, you've got all you've got your street team, your launch team all put together. What do you do?

Vince Warnock 6:32
Well, the main thing you want to do, if you think about the process you want to do here, the whole purpose of launching the books, like doing a hard launch, rather than just kind of putting it on Amazon and then just hoping it goes well, is you want to create momentum. And the reason you want to do that is because Amazon looks at every new book and and honestly, so just secretly, by the way, I wrote a script, I probably shouldn't talk about this publicly because of Amazon find. But I wrote a script a few years back now that basically scans, Amazon every two hours, just goes through every two hours looks at every category there tells me exactly how many books are launched in that category tells me what kind of movement there is there, how many book sales, we can estimate from there and uses AI to kind of predict, if we wouldn't be in that category, how many sales would we need to top that category. So it's kind of a useful script, I thought it was quite handy.

Jennie Wright 7:21
We can get our hands on that where

Vince Warnock 7:24
there is something that we do as part of our service. So if anyone wants to publish, just come reach out to me, honestly, I'll make it real easy. And we include that as part of our category research for you. So super handy. But the key thing there, though, is that there are so many new books every single minute, basically that go on to Amazon. And as a result, Amazon's trying to work out which of these titles are worth putting in front of readers, which of these titles are really going to resonate with them, because if they're, if they're promoting a whole pile of books that aren't relevant to their readers, then nobody's going to make any sales and Amazon makes no money. So they really want to put the stuff in front of you that you want to buy. And the way to do that is they look at what is the interest in this, like how many people are in like how many people were standing to move on this book already. So if you can create a massive momentum right at the time of launch, that's when Amazon pay attention to this. And that's when they go, Hey, I'm gonna put this on the recommendation engine, I'm going to put this on the up and coming on the bestseller lists all these kinds of things. So the more and it gives you more and more visibility, which will get you more and more traction. So momentum kind of begets momentum in this case. So because of that your launch itself, you want to create an event around this that actually captures that momentum. So one of the things I highly encourage all my authors to do is to do a zoom party. And and we call it a party, because it's a lot of fun. But you don't just do a zoom call and you go okay, everyone share this now and everyone can you do a review and all this kind of thing. You literally you have prizes you have we had a DJ at a couple of them, which was really interesting, because it's basically just someone playing Spotify, but it was kind of cool. We need to say all this music Panzanella Okay, right now, everyone, here's what we want to do. And you get them to show you proof you go, we want everyone now to review the book. So go out there review, take a screenshot, show me what that looks like, send it back to me now. Oh, and John's won the prize and James one verse. And so you kind of create a bit of a frenzy about that. And you get them all to do this at a set period of time. So we do a launch party that's usually two hours long. And then that two hours you want the maximum amount of book sales, maximum amount of tagging you on social media and putting it out there to everyone and the maximum amount of ratings and reviews as well.

Alyson Lex 9:36
Okay, so I have a question that is going to lead into a thought slash ideas slash another question. I would use one. I know Do you want all of these sales to happen in a certain number of hour period? Or do you want the sales to happen over a certain number of days the first week when Do you really want this this launch rush of book sales to happen,

Vince Warnock 10:07
we work in two hour blocks, because that's how, that's how Amazon calculate bestsellers. So they look at how many books sales you've had in a two hour period, then they go on to the next two hour period, etc. So for you, you kind of want that early momentum as much as you can in that first two hours. And then from there, you want to make sure that you've still got momentum happening for the next couple of days, because that'll keep you on the bestseller lists, or more chance that we're getting on bestseller in different categories as well. The key thing to note, though, is it's a really awkward one, because and this is the challenge we have, you actually have to publish the book first, and then have the book put our book publishing party, you can't go right, I'm gonna flick the switch now because it takes a few hours for it to take effect. And there's nothing more boring than sitting on a zoom call going should be there for everyone. Now, is that there for you? No. Okay, well wait for it to go live in Canada or wait for it to go live in the UK Wait, forget London, Australia. So you really want to we just do basically we publish the book first, put it there, we get any author copies, because author copies don't count towards bestseller status. So if you want to buy author copies, that means you just basically get them at with the cost price of those. So get those shipped to yourself and everything get ready. And then at that launch is when everybody starts buying, rating, reviewing all those kind of things. And then you just kind of you've got that that group, that groups also going to spread the word out there on social media and things like that, as well. We also do, and I'll give you some hot tips here. This is some tricks that we've used in the past, one of the ones we do is, don't buy one copy, if you've got a huge fan base, or you've got some people at launch tribe that have been there with you, and they're going, Hey, I'm really invested in making sure this succeeds, then don't get them to buy a copy of your book, get them to buy three copies. And I know that sounds like a big ask, but what you do is something in return. So what we do is we do the three copies, three copy exchange, so we say to them, Look, buy three copies of this book, give those away to anyone you know, so buy those three copies, send it to anybody you know. And in exchange, if you show us proof that you bought those three copies, I'm going to send you a personally signed copy of the book. So you'll have your author copies, you sign it, you ship it to that individual, it costs you a little bit more obviously, you've got to ship that individual book, that you don't just get one sale, you get three at the time of the launch. Okay,

Jennie Wright 12:26
people are Yeah, Allison go, you're,

Alyson Lex 12:28
I know you have a better question. So we're going to hold my idea until your question is done, do it.

Jennie Wright 12:34
The people actually go for that, do they do the three copy exchange?

Vince Warnock 12:38
No, obviously not everybody does, I would say most of the book launch parties we've done, it would be around, probably 15% of them would buy the three copies. Because if you think about it, getting a signed copy of a book, if you're invested in that, but getting a signed copy is like it's it's something quite special. And when your books like $15, they're basically paying $45 Plus shipping, and then they're getting a free copy of the sent to them that signed so and they've got prizes to give away on your gifts to give away that other people as well. So for 15% of the people that are in that launch party, this is a big deal. And if you've got a big number in there, like with the last launch party I did, we had, I think about 120 people in there. So when you've got like 16, people buying three copies each, that's the same as basic, let's do almost half of what you were selling through the rest of them. So it's a good way of kind of getting them invested in there, then you have, then you have giveaways and things like that as well that you can do within that space. The other things so bestseller lists are a really interesting one, I'm just gonna break this down for a moment, because every entrepreneur wants to be a best seller. But you need to look at how to be a best seller. There's three different kind of categories here. There's Amazon bestseller status, right, which does count it is a good way to become a bestseller. And so that you need to basically top a category in that two hour period and keep that sustained for you know another at least probably a day. So to do that, that's relatively easy if you know what categories to be in. In fact, one of my clients have the dream scenario, we were going through analyzing the categories, we can put the book in and make sure those categories fit with the the type of book that we're going through analyzing and just when we did our scrape of Amazon, our latest update, we noticed there were two brand new categories that opened up on Amazon that both fit this person's book. And we're like you got to be kidding me. So they had to sell one copy to be the best seller and that's in that category. Now, obviously, they sold a lot more than that they sold about, I think couple of 100 copies, but they will be a seller in about 10 categories at the time that they launch and they became an Amazon bestseller. So that's the relatively easy one if you know what you're doing. Then you have the two other types of bestseller lists. And if you're aiming for these, there's different strategies that are involved. One of them is a New York Times bestseller it is like there's a whole pile of ones that New York Times Forbes all these kind of ones as well. To get on those lists you you generally need to be an attorney traditional publisher with a traditional publisher, and it has to be a traditional publisher that is aligned with New York Times, for example. And they're basically the way if you look at the terms and conditions of the bestseller status for them. It is we they look at book sales, they look at book sale numbers. However, they also look at the reputation of those books sales. In other words, they're looking at who the publishing company that you are with, is, and do they actually know that company themselves do they recommend their company. So it's incredibly hard to get on those lists. And usually, if you have a look at who tops those lists, they're all from certain publishing houses. So there's kind of a little bit of an inside deal that they've got there. But then you have the ones that are kind of based on book sales. And this is Wall Street Journal. This is USA Today. These are bookseller lists where they purely count book sales, but they wait book sales from bookstores higher than Amazon. And the reason for that, which I actually quite like is they're trying to basically help the bookstores they're trying to keep bookstores afloat, they really back Mom and Pop bookstores or even some of the larger bookstores, the physical locations, versus, you know, Amazon, who just sell everything online. So as a result, you need to tailor your approach to that. So most of us when we self published, we will put it on Amazon, we will send that Amazon link to everyone, we will say give us the rating review on Amazon, buy the books off Amazon, buy three copies, I'll send you another one, those kinds of things, we do all those kinds of tactics. However, if you really want to get on the Wall Street Journal best selling list, don't send them to Amazon, send them to something like and, fulfill through Amazon, or get to gets the books from Amazon, but distributes through local book shops. So for someone like Wall Street Journal, they can't distinguish a book sale from a mom and pop bookstore. So for them, that is considered to be a higher waited sale. Now to do that, you do have to sell between one and 5000 copies on your first day. And to do that is obviously quite difficult, you need to have a pretty big tribe to be able to do that. And also, it depends heavily on who else is watching on that day. So I mean, if you know, Dan Pink or, or Seth Godin, or any of those kind of guys are launching a book on the same day as you and you're doing a book on marketing, forget about it, there's no way you're going to top that list, because when they then they sell a book they sell, you know, 50,000 copies immediately and things so, so just got to make sure you know what else is on the horizon. But it just means you've got to tailor your approach. So most of the time, we focus purely on the Amazon bestseller status. For most of the entrepreneurs we work with, they're more interested in being able to say that they're a best selling author, and to get their copy in the hands of as many people as possible.

Alyson Lex 17:46
Okay, so I know Jenny has more questions. But I've now waited for like three questions. So this is my idea. And I think that you and Jenny should work together on the list, build book, launch the LBL. And marry together the idea of a list build Summit, with a book launch party in it. So you're building the list, book launch party, the whole concept is about the book launch, you have VIP, which might include a copy of the book, or you get free a VIP, if you buy a book or right like there's all these options that the experts then help promote that you also have the street team for your book launch. So they're promoting the event. And you guys need to talk and do this because I think this would help your clients not only launch their books like crazy, but build their list like crazy and grow their businesses like crazy. And episode over new business started. Thank you very much. Have a great day.

Jennie Wright 18:55
I love you. Yeah, love you.

Vince Warnock 18:57
It's an interesting approach, though. And this is something where, like, if it's a clever approach, if you go, I'm selling a book, then essentially you're saying to people, if this book is of interest to you, in other words, here's the content of the book, here's what you're going to think and feel and do at the end of this book. So this is what this book is going to give you. Then you're selling that book based on its merit. If you do something like you just mentioned, like if you, for example, had a summit, and you said to everybody, and the ticket for the summit is a book sale. So in other words, rather than buying a ticket to this, you buy a book, a copy of the book, you basically prove that you've bought the copy of the book, you get access to the summit, suddenly, that book is so much more than just what's in that book. And now you've got people that have bought a book that they're going you know what, at some point I want to get to read this right now I need to buy this now. So I've got access to the summit that is going to help you immensely to create that momentum early on, especially if it's event based because if it's event based, obviously there's that timeframe around it where you go right okay, now you can buy your ticket, which of course is your copy of the book.

Jennie Wright 19:58
So with all with Full disclosure, well, partial disclosure, I have not I have signed a nondisclosure agreement. So there's certain things I can't talk about. But for the spouse of a very prominent Rockstar, from the 80s, and 90s, who wrote a book, I was involved in their launch party. And the launch party was a giveaway. So there was 25 of her bestest and closest friends who had gifts that they could provide in this thing. And the way to get the entrance to those guests, they were really good stunning things to wear was you had to put in your name, your email, and your Amazon code, like the purchase code from when you purchase the book. Yeah, right, to get access to these things, right. So and then you could get access, and I created the whole thing alongside like our agent and the woman and everything. And it worked out really, really well. So like Allison's idea is spot on grew her list, which was great. There was a VIP in the inside, where people could, you know, purchase the VIP. So she made VIP sales. It's a model that I think would work. Like, I think it would be a stellar model for people to use. And it would work really, really well you just have to have the right people as part of that giveaway or Summit, or however it's going to be. But that could I mean, it's two birds one stone, like,

Vince Warnock 21:29
again, you've added value to their book is no longer, you know, $20 or $15, or whatever on Amazon, their book is now so much more valuable to them. Because that stuff

Jennie Wright 21:38
dropped the price on that book for that three days, because there's a three day thing for that three day period, the price on the book was like stupid low. Yep, really, really just I think it was like not even 499 or something silly. Like it wasn't even about the the cost of the book, it was about the book sales, right. So if you can do that for three days,

Vince Warnock 21:58
then you VIP together, right? VIP ticket becomes by three copies, or by five copies.

Jennie Wright 22:05
I mean, I think Allison thinks we should talk I kind of agree.

Vince Warnock 22:10
Long ago that we should never ignore Ellison. So

Alyson Lex 22:14
this is my husband and son that because that's different. That's a totally different ballgame.

Jennie Wright 22:23
That's a totally different podcast with two totally different hosts just gonna say

Vince Warnock 22:26
you did raise something there, which was really important, because when you say they reduce the price of the book, this is a mindset that we need to get people around. And I do a lot of work with my authors, when they when they're coming through. A lot of people have a mentality that if I write a book, then that book is going to make me rich, right? So they go in there, and they go, I'm gonna be the next JK Rowling, which you're not. You're not mean to transgender. But anyway, I'm so sorry, when you write this book, like, I can tell you now my best seller, my best selling book, I would have made about probably over the, I think it's been published about four or five years, I would have made about 40,000 from that book, which is a nice amount of money. But over that amount of years, that's not a living, there's nowhere near living or anything. And unless you're producing book after book after book, and they're selling, and they're selling, they're selling, it's a zero sum game, like, the longer your books in market, the less sales you're gonna have. So don't focus on those books, sales, focus on how you can make money on that book. And that's one of the really important things. We do these collaboration books at the moment. And I've said to everybody, anyone that contributes in these books, so we have like 10 to 15 authors come together, or 10 to 15 entrepreneurs come together, they write a chapter each. We don't give them any of the books sell money, and we don't take any of the books on money either. We just give it all to charity. And the reason for that is that's not where you make the money. Instead, what we do is we say right, one month after the publication date, so you've had their bestseller status, you're now a best selling water. We've given you 10 copies of the physical book, we give you 10 copies of the book, all those kinds of things. But one month after that date, we give you all the ebook files. So we give you the Mobi file that the ones that the COBie the Mobi, the Mobi, that epub and the PDF, always forget what platforms are all on. But we give you all the different versions of the ebook. And we teach you how to use that to generate leads, we teach you how to use that to get booked at summits, or, I mean for myself, like, people don't people underestimate how impactful becoming an author is. I remember prior to my first book publishing, I would charge about anywhere between three and 5000, depending on the summit itself. At the conference itself, I would charge about three to 5000 to do a keynote at a conference. The moment my book was published, I ended up in a bidding war between three different conferences who wanted me to speak there, but we were all on the same day in different parts of the world. And that price went up to 20,000. And from the price Yeah, I ended up but that was my new price. But the interesting thing is, and unfortunately this happened just before COVID and I'm in 2019, I had a conference approached me and said, Look, we want you to fly the fly to San Francisco was fly to San Francisco, we want you to speak at the summit. However, we know your rights. And we don't have that much money set aside for speakers, because it was a smaller fee, there was only gonna be about 5000 people there, they said. So instead of that, we can only afford $5,000. But we have a budget set aside, to basically give value to the people that are attending. So how about we pay you $5,000. And we buy 5000 copies of your book, and you can do a book signing at the event, I'm doing like this mental calculation really quickly going, Oh, my goodness, that's way more money than 10 $20,000, all that this is a no brainer. So all of a sudden, I had a new way for me to get value from the summit. And the best part of it, I was literally going to sit there and have these 5000 people come up and interact with me, which means I'm building my audience while I'm here as well, I'm looking for prospective clients, or partners, or joint collaborations and all these kinds of things. So there was a huge opportunity, unfortunately, that fell through because they cancelled the conference due to COVID. But it'll come back one day as well. But all of these different things are ways that you can use their book to make money, don't focus on the book sales, like the money that you get from the book sales, because it will be like, honestly, it will be way less than you probably imagined, but focus on how you can use it. And that brings me to the other problem you always get, which is the amount of people that you talk to and they go, oh, yeah, I'm an author. You go, yeah, yeah, it's on the shelf behind me there. The amount of people that write a book, and then better their books sits on their shelf, and they feel good about that. Their books should be working for you. Their books should be making you money, that book should be out there. Generating your leads, adding value to your current customers adding value to anyone who goes through your pipeline, adding value to a summit that you're on giving the freebies and giveaways and all sorts of stuff as well. You should be making that book work hard for you.

Jennie Wright 26:51
Well, considering how hard you work to make the book then Yeah, absolutely. It should be working as frickin tail off for you. And for several years, right? And there's ways to do that you were saying that, you know, once the launch is done, you give them the files, the version of the book, and you keep you teach people how to get leads and stuff like that. Are you talking about taking those files and making a lead magnet out of it? Or how do you suggest that

Vince Warnock 27:13
lead magnets are one of those ways like doing free book giveaway. So you can also do lead magnets free books of the print version. It's, it's kind of a cheeky one, but it is accurate. So you're not misleading people. But basically what you do is you say, look, we'll give you a free copy of the print book, which everyone goes, Oh, that's cool. All you need to do is pay $10 and shipping. Now, of course, if you know how Amazon works, the if they're paying $10, that's the cost of manufacturing the book, that's the cost of shipping the book, and you probably make a couple of dollars on the top as well. So it's not, you're still making money on that book. And they get their hands on a physical copy of it, which is really good. And this is why I also encourage people, if you are self publishing, make sure you've got a call to action in the back of your book have a QR code and the QR code, we used to laugh at QR codes coming back. I know pandemic's made QR codes really popular, I use that code in there. So that way, you know, like you can have it UTM tracks. So in other words, when they when they use the UTM code, you know, they came from a physical copy of the book, you know that they're going to a page where you can promote other things as well as send it to your, your link tree or something along those lines.

Jennie Wright 28:17
Yeah, and I just learned this the hard way, by the way, with a client that used a QR code for a conference, you can actually build these things for free. If you have Adobe Suite, you can build your QR code completely for free. You don't have to pay for a subscription service. And I just saved you a bunch of money. There you go.

Vince Warnock 28:34
I was gonna say you don't even need Adobe Suite. Seriously. There's a view just go QR code generator online.

Jennie Wright 28:39
I did that. Yeah. And the after 14 days, it it shut it off.

Vince Warnock 28:44
Okay, now there's some there's some you've got to find the right ones there. But yeah, it does work.

Jennie Wright 28:49
It was it was a real, it was a real pain in the butt because it's a real pain in the butt. But yeah.

Vince Warnock 28:54
So that's one way of making. You can also use it to give to your clients, when they go through your funnel. Or as evaluated when they signed with you. You say, Hey, I'm gonna send you a copy of my book and they go, Oh, my goodness, you can actually use it. In fact, I had, I teach a lot of people how to do cold outreach, right in a way that's really authentic and doesn't feel creepy and things like that. But I had it done to me in a masterclass way, like this guy was an absolute expert. He contacted me on LinkedIn. He sent me a thing and said, Look, you know, I noticed that we are in the same kind of circles. We have the same kind of people. I'd love to connect with you and get to know you. And I thought, sure, okay, I accepted this request. Then he came back and he said, actually now and you could tell that this was scripted, but it's so it was so good. I didn't even care. I knew I was being marketed to I knew I was being sold to I was still a okay with that. It was just literally a masterclass. He came back and said, I'm looking at your profiling events, I noticed that you focus on XYZ. I've actually read in a book. I would love to send you a free copy and get your feedback on this. Now straight away He makes me feel important because it's a well, if he's asked me my opinion, oh, very smooth, and, and then I said, yeah, absolutely gave him gave him my address, he sent me a copy of the book. A three days later, he came back with, hey, the copy of the book is on its way. By the way, I'm in your town next Saturday, I'm doing an event there. I would love to have you as my personal guest. And I'm sitting in this conference for there where they're doing this big sales pitch, and I'm going, Well played, sir. Well played. Yeah, it's probably it wasn't really suitable for me at all. But that book was what hooked me in and everybody likes something for free. And everybody likes books. I love books. Honestly, my favorite place to go is the bookstore. Even if I'm not buying anything, I'll just walk around, pick up books, look at them read the back, then. It's just something about a bookshop that makes you feel intelligent, which I know sounds lame. Makes you go

Alyson Lex 30:50
look at our backgrounds for all. We all have books in our backgrounds.

Vince Warnock 30:54
Yeah, yeah. Now the amount of books I have that I've never read.

Alyson Lex 30:59
I can talk about that. Well, and I'm going to tell you, both of you, if you ever come to Baltimore, you let me know there's something here called the book thing. And it's, it's free books. Oh, okay. will give their unused and unwanted books. Yeah. And you go and get free books. And it's in a downtown area of Baltimore that does not have easy access to books. We have

Vince Warnock 31:29
exchanges over here where they're like, somewhat usually the old fridges, it's really crazy. Like old fridges, where you go up, you open a song on a street corner, you go open the fridge, and it's full of all these books, and you just replace it with a book. So you go there and get what I want to read that one, I'll put this one in here, but

Alyson Lex 31:43
a little free libraries. I think the UK has phone booths, so red phone booths, they do the free libraries in those. But yes, books have that intrinsic value, they people don't want to get rid of them, if they have them. I have a bunch of books that I don't know why I have them. I was given them maybe at an event and they're not. Like, I'm not going to reread these things, but I can't get rid of it. Because I haven't been done with the book thing. And while I take them down there, but um, alright, so you've launched it, you're leveraging it, about how long before you should think about writing your next book?

Vince Warnock 32:25
You're asking the wrong person, I'm always writing three or four books at the same time. Wow. So

Alyson Lex 32:30
how long have you recommend? Well,

Vince Warnock 32:33
it depends on the purpose for that book, to be honest. And it depends on what you're trying to achieve there. Because you've got to, you've got to picture that running a book is a lot of work, it really is, if you're running solo books, or just you as an author, you're running anywhere from 35 to 60,000 words, which is a lot. And it's a big effort. And I can tell you now you're gonna go through a whole process, as you write their book, you're gonna go through impostor syndrome, screaming at you, you're gonna go through self doubt, you're gonna get to the point where you realize I'm going to have to rewrite most of this book, because my thinking has changed on this topic. So there's a whole pile of challenges you're going to have writing that book. So if you're putting that kind of effort in there, you need to be clear on what you want to achieve with this. Is this something that you are using as a way to generate leads or generate new clients? Is there something that you're using to position yourself as an expert or a thought leader, and by the way, can achieve all of these different things? It's no problem with any of those as something because you just really passionate about writing this book. And if you clear on all of those different factors, then that's going to help, you know, should I be writing my next book now. So I've got clients who let you know, last year, I think I helped about 20 of my clients become authors through my publishing company, got to the end of the year, and realize that that's 20 Out of the, you know, 350, or whatever clients that I've got, and I loved that, and we will the rest of those didn't have time to write a full book. So how can I leverage it. So we did collaboration books, where we go, okay, instead of writing a whole book, you write three to 5000 words, that's a lot easier, I had one woman write that in a weekend. And if somebody has paid three months, so it just depends on your schedule. But from that, they will go okay, I'm doing this collaboration book. And then I want to write my solo book, I've got others who have written a solo book, and then go actually, now I want to do a repurpose book. Because you may have a whole pile of content, you've written for something else, like you've got your courses, you've got your programs, you've got all this content that exists, you actually want to put it together in a book, which will position you as a thought leader, and you can give that as part of your course. So everyone will have a physical copy of your book as well. So if you're clear on the purpose, you'll know when you should be writing your next one, but honestly, I think everyone should be writing all the time anyway. Even if it's not for a book if it's just for content and things. It's an incredibly cathartic process. And it helps you like when you write your first book, you'll realize it helps you to articulate your thinking. So a lot of us when we're teaching staff, we go out there and we kind of ramble on and we teach all this different methodology. We'll teach people about what we're trying to do. Your impact to them. But actually having to put it in a book and structure it in a way that makes sense to people helps you to structure it mentally when you're empowering it somebody else. So there's a whole pile of additional benefits that you just don't even think of with books.

Alyson Lex 35:15
Well, I'm dense, it sounds like we're gonna have to have you back to talk about all of those different ways to write. Because I've heard of solo books, I've heard of collaboration books, but you're talking, you're starting to go into a whole new language with the repurpose and other types. So until then, where can our listeners connect with you?

Vince Warnock 35:35
Oh, man, I make this so hard for everybody. No, I'm kidding. I make it real easy. Just go to chase in the And there's the home of my podcast, it's the home of my books. There's a link on there. If anyone ever wants to talk to me about becoming an author, or just run their ideas pass me or anything to do with marketing. Actually, there's this link there to book a free free strategy call. I'm always open to meeting new people always open to helping people out as much as I can. You're also gonna see links on there to becoming an author as well. So if you really want to do that, we've got ways that we can make it really easy for you. And repurpose books are a good example, the collaboration books we've got, I think there's about three that we're looking for a couple of authors at the moment, and they will be launching a whole new pile in about three months time. So yeah, just reach out to me all my links to social are on there as well. Unless you're a spammer just connect with me. I love meeting new people. If you're a spammer, they just don't that really pays me off.

Jennie Wright 36:29
Yeah, does the same Jess, Tiffany, Vince, this has been fantastic, we are absolutely gonna have to have you back on because we just could not get everything into one episode with you, which is the usual. Yeah, when we talk to you, it's like, hey, let's talk for 15 minutes. And then 45 minutes later, Allison's like, I gotta go get my kid. I mean, this, this is the thing with you. And we when we appreciate it. So thank you for delivering a ton of information, go and check out vents everywhere on social, go check out everything that he was talking about, which is fantastic. And also you'll find all the show notes and all the resources that he talked about, including the book by Jonah Berger, which is contagious, and we're gonna put a link for that in our resource section. Just go to system to forward slash 178. And that's going to be Vince's episode with all the information that you need to find them, contact him. And if you're a spammer, just disregard and keep going. So thanks so much for being here. Vince, we really appreciate your time.

Vince Warnock 37:22
Oh, my goodness, always fun catching up with you, too. You too have legit you. Like it's not often you meet people in the industry where you go, I totally backed these people. They know what they're talking about. They they really are the experts in this area. So being on your show is an honor seriously. Thank you. Thank you.

Jennie Wright 37:39
Yeah, that's awesome. It's a nice kind of compliment. Alright, everybody, make sure you check out the episode here and go check out the show notes with Vince. And also make sure you're following us so you don't miss future episodes because we're gonna bring them back. That's going to happen it'll have to happen in 2023 Because also now I have managed to book up this entire podcast so we will make that happen. Thanks so much for being here. Everybody will talk to you soon. Take care.



Episode 161 – The Biggest Needle Mover for a Successful Challenge with Stirling Gardner

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