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What We Talk About

We love a marketing strategy that includes long-term growth strategies like booking podcasts. We call this a slow-burn strategy – one that will pay off for months or even years after you book the interview.

BUT to take advantage of this strategy, you’ve got to be a great guest. Get yourself together, find the right shows, and show up the right way to make it work for you.

Nancy Juetten is here to help us stand out from the massive crowd of potential guests so you can leverage this platform for yourself.

Resources

Download the Media One Sheet Gift Template so folks can get ready for big opportunities, starting right now.  It’s available at www.getknowngetpaid.com/MOS 

Those who want to join the get known get paid conversation can also join Nancy’s 1800+ experts, speakers, and authors at www.getknowngetpaid.com/group

Podcast Booking Resources

Poddit.net
Podcastbooker.com
Matchmaker.fm
Poddit Facebook Group

Mentioned in the Episode:

The Speaking Show with David Newman

Listen to more:

Episode 24 – How Podcasts Generate Leads For Your Business with Brent Basham
Episode 53 – The Real Secret to Podcasting Success with Mark Aisquith

Our transcript hasn't been proofed, so there will probably be some errors. Sorry about that!

Alyson Lex 0:01
We have talked a lot about why it's important that you're putting yourself out there. As a podcast guest on other people's stages, list build events, like summit's taking advantage of all of these huge opportunities for exposure, and connecting with OPM, other people's audiences. What we haven't talked a lot about yet, is really how to make sure you are ready to take advantage of those opportunities to show up the right way to present yourself in the best light. And so when we met Nancy jotain, who helps you get known and get paid, we knew that she would be able to help us explain to you exactly what you need to do step by step. So Nancy, thank you so much for being here with us today.

Unknown Speaker 0:51
My pleasure. Thanks for having me.

Alyson Lex 0:54
Before we dive into how to show up, I'd love to know what's working right now to find those opportunities I was just talking about?

Unknown Speaker 1:04
Well, I'm a big believer that we should both respond to opportunities and initiate contact to create opportunities, and that when you do both of those things, you're going to set yourself up for the best possible success. If you are a new person who has not developed a lot of experience yet, as a podcast guest, there are powerful ways you can pick the low hanging fruit to create a powerful podcast, publicity basket. So a couple of suggestions would be on Facebook, there are actually Facebook groups that are dedicated to matchmaking between guests and hosts. And I would recommend that you join these groups to both observe how people are making their approach, and then also to initiate response to opportunities that are coming your way. Because the first few times that you get selected, you get so excited. And then one good thing leads to another and all of a sudden you say to yourself, so let's just say you've done 20 shows and it's been fun and fruitful, then you come to the place where you say my work deserves a much bigger audience. And I'm confident and ready. That's when you want to start initiating outgoing pitches to places where you have the mindset around being worthy to take this your place there. So number one is join those podcasts, guest collaboration groups and podcast guest collaboration would be one of them. Just Google podcast guesting in your Facebook, search bar, and you'll find places where 1000s and 1000s of people or other gathering. Another resource I recommend is called podcast, Booker calm. And this is a place where you can post your profile and demonstrate how media ready media savvy and on message you are. And just two weeks ago, I posted my own profile there and got booked three times instantaneously, simply by responding to hosts that liked what they saw enough to reach out to talk to me. So those are two very simple things that you can do right away to put yourself in a position to respond to opportunities.

Alyson Lex 3:25
So you mentioned responding to opportunities, but I'm also really interested in initiating or creating these opportunities. Can you tell me just a little bit about that? Well, you know,

Unknown Speaker 3:36
if you want to go to the show, you got to get ready to go before you take the stage, right. So if you want to respond to opportunities, or initiate opportunities, it's important to think first about what you have to bring to an audience and why you are the perfect person to deliver the magic and what specifically the magic is that you're going to bring so that you can present that in a way that can create a wow reaction. I'm a big fan of inviting podcast guests, aspiring podcast guests to create a media one sheet that showcases their bio, their favorite media topics that are timely, newsworthy, relevant, interesting, provocative, compelling, and not the least bit boring. of how you can find them on social media so hosts can find out to what extent you have a following that can actually help them get more listeners and more downloads, and also share some words of praise from podcast hosts or event planners that speak to what an amazing guest you are, how media ready media savvy on and on point you are, how funny you are, how good you are with the sassy soundbite because when you present also your headshot because not all podcasts are just audio. If you've got a face that only radio would love, then sometimes podcasting is a great opportunity. But some podcasts are also video podcasts. So you want to be able to show that you are an attractive person who can deliver the Wow. So create a media one sheet that speaks to all these things. And then when you make your approach, they'll often say, as you do, won't you please fill out our guest application form. And it will say, all the various things you have to have, well, you will have already done that work because you have your media when she prepared. So it's simply a matter of cut, paste and go. And I think an important part of this is a mindset piece. I say to people believe and behave as if the most important show was calling you tomorrow, show up like a pro at Hello, and anticipate that you're going to have 40 to 50 shows booked in this calendar year, you as a business owner, do not want to be hunting and pecking to find all of the important essential information that a host wants you to supply. To stop your workflow you want to be able to grab go and get on with it. So believe in start podcast guessing with that mindset, clear in your mind, so that you can start leapfrogging over the lowest hanging fruit and get on to the bigger audiences where there's hundreds or 1000s of people listening. Because that's when you can start making an impact that will ping pong people into your world so that you can ultimately profit.

Jennie Wright 6:28
There's a lot that you've been saying, which I think is fabulous. And it's one of the things that I work with my clients when I'm doing coaching as I get them into podcasting, to being a guest and everything, which I think is awesome. I want to talk to you about a technique that I see a lot of people doing, and it drives me insane. And this is the spray and pray kind of technique. And I want you to I want to ask you what you think about this sort of spray and pray approach to getting on to podcasts, does it work, doesn't work.

Unknown Speaker 7:00
spray and pray never has worked. It never will work. And you should set it aside right now. Before I became this brilliant podcast guest that teaches other people to become a brilliant podcast guest. I used to own my own publicity agency. And I represented big name companies like France chocolates and Seattle chocolate company, and even Roger Starbuck, big name companies, you don't spray and pray big name companies out and say I'm giving everything I'm giving all this information to everybody all at the same time. And I'm expecting you the reporter the person of interest to take interest in what I'm talking about. My core value is that you will see here and celebrate the show that you want to be on before you make your pitch. Consider what the host is looking for. The host wants to talk to interesting people that have new things to say that haven't been said before. The host is interested in having his or her star rise a little bit higher for the opportunity to talk to people who have influence and that they can learn from and be better from the host is interested in serving their audience in a way that will be world class and brilliant. So if you're spraying and praying the same thing to everybody and saying the same thing to everybody all at once, what's special, different and preferred about that? And why would anyone possibly want to choose you? It doesn't have to be hard, simple things before you pitch. Listen for 10 minutes to the show. Get the vibe, see if it's a fit for where you would like to be. Look at the shows that have been produced. Most recently. It's all there on iTunes, see what kinds of guests they've had and whether or not they've even covered your subject matter. Another thing you can do is listen to a full show with your full attention, write a five star review to the host and say I loved Episode 168 in particular, and here's why. And I can't wait to tune into other shows, which is

Jennie Wright 9:03
exactly what you did for us.

Unknown Speaker 9:05
Yeah. People peep hosts like that. Isn't it nice? When people actually demonstrate in specific terms, then they've listened to the show, they see that they could add value to the show. And then maybe even even if they've covered your topic before, you can say I know you talk to so and so about x I actually do the similar kind of work, but I have a completely polarizing point of view. That can be a really interesting continuation of that conversation. Are you interested? That's interesting.

Jennie Wright 9:32
You did something really interesting with us where you gave us the five star we're just being transparent. You gave us a review. And you know, you listen to the podcast and then in your you know, in the application process because we have an application process. You even said I you know, I looked through all of your episodes and I didn't see that you had done an episode specifically on this. But I think it would be a value to your people, etc, etc. And that caught our eye. We have a lot of people who apply to be on the podcast, more Very grateful for that. And we appreciate the people who do so. But there is a bit of the copy paste happening. And sometimes we know they haven't listened to us before. They don't know who we are, we've got on pre calls, and they're like, I have no idea who you are, I don't know what you do at all. So we've had that happen, and you know, not gonna knock them. That's just their way of doing it. But this other approach that you're looking at, which rarely just takes about 10 minutes, just 10 minutes, can make a huge difference.

Unknown Speaker 10:31
So 10 minutes that you spend you, the Royal you seeing, hearing and celebrating someone else's hard, won hard work behind the scenes podcast, and being able to say something about what you appreciate about the podcast before you talk about yourself. That's just being a good human being. And I think to the extent that we can all be better human beings and see here and celebrate what the host is, is about and what they're trying to accomplish, the more we can accomplish magnificent things, because you know what, I'm guessing that you have many, many people that have a brand new book out that want to sell a whole lot more books, and they're looking at you as an avenue to possibly help them sell more books. You're not in the business of being promotional partners, for book authors, you're in the business of creating conversations and dialogues around subject matter that's bigger than the book. So take your eye off your own agenda and think about how you can have a bigger conversation. I think that's how we can not only make a winning approach to a host, but there's the possibility of creating a relationship with that host that can turn into something entirely more brilliant than we ever thought possible. Because it could be that you are this unicorn guest that was well prepared and on message and delivered value. And when the microphone goes silent, the host says that was awesome. Right? Maybe we should figure out ways we're supposed to play together. Or maybe I need to introduce you too. Or maybe maybe maybe like what what has happened for you when you've had a great guest?

Alyson Lex 12:11
Exactly, exactly. You're right. And we've done that. And I like how you call them unicorn guests. Because how do we create a system around this so that we are those unicorn guests that get booked the most that hosts want to refer to other people? And we just continue to leverage all of that.

Unknown Speaker 12:30
How do we do? Well, how do we do it a system?

Unknown Speaker 12:35
Okay.

Unknown Speaker 12:37
First off, I want to say that there are 1.8 million podcasts on the air today, and more are starting every minute. And just out of the box, you can say to yourself, I am overwhelmed. I don't even know where to start. And what I say to all of my clients is start with eight really great shows, that could be a perfect match for you. So a system would be create a spreadsheet. I call it a podcast, profit spreadsheet spreadsheet, and identify the eight really great shows that are in your niche audience that serve your the problem that you solve. I want you to listen to eight identify eight shows, listen to eight shows, post eight five star reviews and make eight specific terrific pitches that reflect the insight that you've gained by participating. If you time block on your calendar, that every Wednesday at 10 o'clock I am. I'm on podcast guesting I'm doing my podcast guest for profit research, you will have eight shows that you can go ahead and pitch. And then the following week, you will follow up I always say I'll follow up with you first, unless I have a follow up with you in a few days unless I hear from you first. That's one of my favorite lines. And sometimes I hear back from people the same day, this was a great pitch you're in I can't wait. So identify those eight really great shows, put them on a spreadsheet, make your approach. Commit to following up the fortune is always in the follow up. And if you have made a really really big pitch to something that you really, really want. Find the courage to find a clever way to get in front of that person. If for some reason you're hearing crickets Can I tell you a story? There was a top five podcasts in marketing and management that I wanted to be on it was called the speaking Show with David Newman. What a perfect show for someone who teaches what I teach. And yet it was an aspirational pitch for me because he didn't know my name. And he talks to some pretty big, big wigs. Okay, so what did I do? Start from the beginning of how you can go the extra mile. I found a way to get his address. So I could ship my boring bio workbook to him with a handwritten note that said, I have a feeling this could be a useful resource for your community. And it might be something fun for us to talk about on a podcast, I'd love for you to take a look, if you should feel so inspired, do something personal and unexpected, then subscribe to the podcast, put a five star review on the podcast that specific can terrific and detailed. So it's not just great work, keep up the great effort. And then look for opportunities. It turned out that this person led a Facebook group of thought leaders and I joined it. I started observing the conversation, then I start participating in the conversation, I start making posts that could stand out to demonstrate that I've got thought leadership of my own to demonstrate, and then he starts to notice me. Awesome. So then it could be that he knows somebody that you know. So it just so happened that one of my colleagues and I was talking about a joint venture and he says, Who do you want to meet? What do you want to accomplish? I said, I would really like to meet David Newman. And he said, I know David Newman, I'll make a warm introduction. Okay, he makes the warm introduction, I do all the things you're supposed to do that I'm telling you to do right now. And then for some reason, I'm hearing crickets. So then I go back to my own behaviors and actions. And I'm going did I over to was I over the top? Did I miss something? Was I offensive? Was there anything crazy random that I did that could have caused this to go completely dark. And I satisfied myself that there wasn't. So here's my fun little follow up. I sent an email and said, if you're not stuck under heavy furniture, won't you please give me a call.

Unknown Speaker 16:46
And Moments later, he said, Oh my god, I loved your book, I was so happy to be introduced by so and so I feel so bad that this didn't happen already. Let's get this booked on December 10 of last year. And let's make it the best show ever. And it was for both of us. And so what I'm demonstrating here is everything that I'm all the steps that I think are important. I follow them myself to great outcomes. And if you follow these steps, you will have great outcomes too. But it does come back to the mindset is, do you want to be on the low hanging fruit where nobody's listening? Or do you want to be on shows where people are actually there. So one more little system to consider when you're doing your homework about these shows, Double check to see that they have 20 or more episodes already produced, make sure that the they're currently producing, make sure that they invite guest experts to be on the show. And then look to see how many five star reviews there are and read them and make sure that you were comfortable that you want to be aligned with a show like that. If you do those simple things, then you're going to be prioritizing the right shows that could be a match for your message. And when you get invited to step up to the microphone, you will rock it and the host will appreciate it and who knows what other wonderful things will happen as a result.

Jennie Wright 18:14
I like and I know that Alison and I, this whole process of building up this podcast has been something really, really easy and interesting for us. There's been some hard points and some some great points. But one of the things that really stands out is when people take the time to actually move some stuff forward. And we're really, really excited that we have we have some ends with some people who have some podcasting software. And what we're seeing emerge is this sort of one, like the standalone one sheet, the standalone bio for podcasting, which I think is great. And here's an interesting fact, this is something that I actually tried to do with my partner was my partner's idea several years ago, and Allison was involved in it. And it was called speaker one sheet. We actually own the URL speaker when she calm Not gonna lie. Right? I think it was right, Allison.

Alyson Lex 19:07
I remember this.

Jennie Wright 19:08
Yeah. And we were actually we were we were hosting it, it was trying, we were trying to make it happen. It's something that we couldn't keep up with. It was very like it would have needed like a whole team and all sorts of stuff. So I was actually in this field at one point, which is really interesting. So I want to ask you, you know, with this whole thing about BIOS and stuff like that, how do we make them stand out? How do we make them work for us, as opposed to against us. And with that, I had a person who approached me on clubhouse, and who tried to pitch me on rewriting my bio for me, and he wanted to know the most crazy insane thing I ever did in my life. Which in my history I there's a couple events that are pretty interesting. And he wanted me to use those they were completely unrelated to my tat like to my thing. He wanted those at the top of my bio. So I want to hear from you. What's the best way we can make these one sheet slash BIOS stick out? And then how is that going to help us to get booked Okay,

Unknown Speaker 20:05
I'm going to say that the bio is not supposed to be for podcast guessing it's not the traditional bio that you would see on a website that says everything you've ever done in your life, and the history and your origin story and all that stuff that we tear and, and discuss and hear discussed online. It's what do you have to bring to that host in that show that will make the show better than it could ever possibly be? Can you demonstrate your credibility? Can you demonstrate your stunning results that you've brought about or some provocative, compelling point of view? And can you do it in a conversational way, where the person can immediately say, world class expert, has time in the trenches has some special to say, and I can't wait to find out what it is. One of the mistakes people make is I mean, I'll give you an example. Someone says to me that she's a financial coach. And then when I read her bio, she tells her personal story about how she went from millions and millions of dollars into debt into being able to be comfortable again. But it nowhere in it does she say that she's ever coached a single client in accomplishing the same result. I said, You are not a financial coach, you are someone who got yourself out of trouble, and who's positioning yourself as someone who could potentially get other people out of trouble, but I don't believe any of it. Because there's no proof. If you say that you followed a specific approach to achieve a result for yourself, and you have since gone on to train 1000s and 1000s of people to have the same result. That's credibility. And that's valuable, to your point about saying random or crazy things that are not relevant or congruent to what it is that you're doing. That may be head turning. But I don't believe that it's aligned and supportive of your goal to be on the guest. It's just it's a way to grab attention. I'm a fan of, you know, if you have, if you have a point of view, or a sassy soundbite that you're known for, or something that quickly summarizes what you're all about, you can lead that. But if it just feels random, it probably feels random to the reader as well. Also, I would say that BIOS should be written in the third person for a podcast host, because then the host can read them as presented and not have to worry about transposing them from the first person to the third person. BIOS, I recommend that you have a 50 word bio and a 100 word bio, because both of those links are going to be suitable for most show formats. If you go really long, well, you've gone really long. And really, the purpose of a podcast is to have a conversation. Let's not take up too much time talking about you, let's talk about what you can do for the reader what you can do for the host, I think that will make for a better outcome. And if you've done a million other things in your life, and some of them are relevant to what you're doing, and some of them are not take the best and leave the rest and keep your eye on the ball.

Alyson Lex 23:17
Okay, so now we've got where to find them, how to connect with them, and how to present ourselves to them. How can we generate leads from this? What role? How do we you know, how do we generate those leads?

Unknown Speaker 23:34
Already, then the all important call to action? You'll have a wonderful conversation with the host, the two hosts, the three hosts, whoever's there, invariably, they're going to say, tell us where can our readers or listeners go to find out more about you? Here's where a lot of people make serious mistakes. They say well, you can find me on Facebook you can find me on Instagram you can download my free gift, you can give me a call, you can send me a smoke signal. You know people give me four or five things that you can do lead with a singular call to action that you can measure and treasure that could be if you're interested in being part of a community of 1800 speakers experts and authors of two big things come on over to the raise your voice make your impact Facebook group you'll find it at get now and get paid comm forward slash group I'll see on the other side. Or it could be if your media when she does lackluster and not blockbuster and you're ready to do something about it right now. Download the media when she'd gift template and I'll see you on the other side. Simply go to this website this extension I'll see you there. But if if you do a podcast and it goes on the air, and you get a whole group of people hopping on over to be part of your group or to download your free gift or to ask for a discovery session, you can measure and treasure those kinds of results and turn them into cash. Those are just three suggestions.

Alyson Lex 25:11
One of the things that I really like to do when I speak or I'm a guest expert is to tailor what my lead magnet is to the topic that I'm speaking on. So if for instance, I'm talking about the five steps to copy the converts, I'm going to give them my sales page that writes itself download because they connect really well. If I'm talking about headlines, I have a headline generator, if I'm talking about emails, I have a subject line swipe file, I have all of these different things. I yeah, I'm doing something right. But by doing that, it's specific. And it's tailored so that there's a, an easy to understand connection between what I'm talking about and what I want their next step to be. So I really thank you so much. And we are going to lead by example, because I am going to say how can we find out more about you?

Unknown Speaker 26:09
Well, if you have loved learning about how to be the podcast, Dream guests that top host can't wait to book creating a media one sheet is going to be a really important step to getting media ready. So visit, get known get paid comm forward slash m o. s, to download a media one sheet that will make it fast and easy for you to create that door opener that can get you booked on shows and have you smiling all the way to the bank.

Jennie Wright 26:37
That's see and you just you followed your own advice you went with the one CTA so good for you on that one. This has been an really interesting episode for a lot of reasons. I mean, coming for the fact that there's two podcasters on the other side of here are even I don't even know if I would call myself a podcaster. It still doesn't feel real that we've done this even though it's been X amount of time. But there's a couple things that I want to reflect on today for the audience. So there's three things I want to create as takeaways. So we can create some granularity and get people moving forward. The first one is I want to say that they're, as you know, Nancy said, there's 1.8 million podcasts that are online today. That means there's a place for you, there's a place for you as a guest, there's a place for you if you want to be a host, but there's a place. So the the adage of I don't know how or I can enter there's not enough for I don't see my thing. This is what we want to dispel. Number one, we want you to create that spreadsheet that Nancy was talking about the podcast profits spreadsheet, go look at those eight great shows, leave those eight great comments or reviews, trade, you know, create those eight great pitches, right. So follow the advice that Nancy said, because I think that's very, very sound. Leaving reviews for shows, you have no idea how much this means to the hosts. It really, really does help not only does it validate what we're doing, but it also gives us great feedback. We've gotten some pretty interesting feedback and reviews on our podcast, we've implemented some of the suggestions, we've noticed some trends and gone oops, okay, let's fix that. We had an audio problem very early on, that we've tried to address and fix very diligently. So take a look at how you can support if you're going to pitch first post, I think that's a good way to put it. The third thing is I want you to preload your week with podcast pitching. I love pre loading my week, meaning I will spend one or two hours on a Monday or even a Sunday, if I'm quite honest. And I will preload my week by doing my pitches, getting them done, my eight pitches, however many you're gonna end up doing. And then that starts my week off great, then I can create that follow up that you were talking about. And I can follow up in three days there, you know, approximately. And here's my bonus that I want you to take from today. And that is taking the time to create a good one sheet or a good bio, or gathering all your information together. You want to make it stupid simple for a host to say yes to you. If we have to go around and find the information or look on different avenues and different platforms to try and figure out who you are and what you do. It really does lower your chance. So get everything organized. It honestly doesn't take as much time as you think. And it will help you get more yeses in the future. So those are three things plus a bonus that I'd like everybody to consider and take away from Nancy June today, which I think is awesome. So, Nancy, I just want to say thank you so much for being on with us today. We really really appreciate it. Justin, I'm so sorry. I apologize.

Unknown Speaker 29:36
It's my pleasure to be here. This was a good conversation. Allison, your irresistible lead magnets are so sexy and that's something that we didn't really talk about but when you have a sexy name for your irresistible lead magnet

Unknown Speaker 29:51
it's good idea.

Alyson Lex 29:53
copywriter.

Jennie Wright 29:56
copywriter for a reason for sure. Absolutely. Thank you, Nancy jetton I got it right this time. I'm so sorry. I hate mispronouncing your name. But I just want to say thanks for being on with us. I really appreciate it. Allison, I really enjoyed this conversation. And if you're listening to this, and you don't want to miss any more episodes from great experts like Nancy, please make sure you're subscribed to the podcast, so you don't miss them. We have three episodes a week, we have a Monday quick tip, Tuesdays with our experts and Thursdays with just Allison and I. So you don't want to miss those at all. And please do leave us a review. We read every single one and we implement what you say if we can into the show. So please make sure that you do that as well. Thanks so much for listening to the System to THRIVE. We're so glad you've been here and we'll be back again soon answering another big question.

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